Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

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wxo
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Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Mon Sep 04, 2017 11:10 am

I've finally decided it's time to focus on my tractor. I'm guessing that this tractor is at least 25 years old, but it has only 1700 hours on it. The hydraulic pump is a bit noisy on startup, but seems to provide plenty of power. I've had it since 1999 and have done virtually nothing to it.
I'm starting with the hydraulic leak.
It's an all hydraulic drive 4x4 compact tractor and the hoses snake around in places that you can't see. I've done some cleaning of the muck I can get to, but have yet to discover where the leak is. Any thoughts or ideas?
The other thing I need to know is how to disconnect these hydraulic hoses if I decide to dig deeper.
Here are some pictures:
IMG_0897.JPG
IMG_0898.JPG
IMG_0899.JPG
IMG_0900.JPG
IMG_0901.JPG

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GMJohnny
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby GMJohnny » Mon Sep 04, 2017 12:06 pm

WXO ----

We normally will find hydraulic leaks by cleaning the machine up first. We pressure wash, degrease, pressure
wash some more, and when you think you have it really clean, wash it one more time. A water-based degreaser
called "purple power" can be purchased at Wal Mart and works sweet. I'd also strongly recommend changing the
hydraulic filter. If you haven't done anything to the tractor in forever and the pump is whining that's a good start.
It might not hurt to change the fluid either, but if you haven't impregnated the fluid with contaminants, and it
looks clear you might be ok there. There's a good chance that your leak is just a loose line, especially if they
snake through spots you can't see and if the ends are hard to reach with normal wrenches. We have a rule that
we follow when fixing machines: Start with the extremely basic and work to the most extreme. Normally, things
will not have catastrophic failures. More often than not the issue is just something small. My two cents.

GM

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:00 pm

Thanks, GM. The fluid is clear and I have a new filter and fluid for it. I wanted to fix the leak before I change the fluid and filter. I'll get cleaning now. :)

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:12 pm

After removing much of the crud, I can see that the main high pressure hoses on the output of the pump are looking bad. The outsides are dry and checked and I can see a bulge on one of them near the fitting. I assume it's condition is due to the heat of the engine. I think it would be best to replace them after 30 years of service. I can get one of them from Messicks in Carlisle for $40 plus shipping. This hose is described as 5/8 x 26-1/4. It has brass screw-on fittings on each end. Is this a generic hydraulic hose that I can go out and buy locally or should I try to stay with the Steiner hose?

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GMJohnny
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby GMJohnny » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:46 pm

I think you can go either way. We typically make (or have made) our hydraulic lines. If you have a
hose making shop around your place, you can get instant gratification by going there. Take in the
hose you have, they will make a duplicate, and walk out the door with it. If you order online and the
hose is not an exact match, you have to go through the hassle of sending it back and such. Hydraulic
hose ends are not all the same, they have different thread pitches and the inside of the coupler is
not the same on all of them. Some have conical ends and some have flat ends with O-rings in them.
I think if you order online, you're making an assumption that someone didn't do some custom work
along the way and it would be a drag if the hose was wrong. I guess if I had to tell you how to do it,
I'd go to a hose shop. Your call.

GM

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:54 pm

Thanks, again, GM. I like the instant gratification thing. :mrgreen:
I'll remove the hoses and get some new ones made. There's a shop not too far from here.

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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:27 pm

Before attacking the hoses, I decided to analyze a problem that has been plaguing me for a long time no. When moving the control handle that moves the tractor forward and backward, it, over time, becoming increasingly jumpy. As I would move the control handle past the center stopping detent, and then go to change direction, the movement of the tractor was at times violent. Being unfamiliar with hydraulically operated machinery, I thought it was something wrong in the system as a whole. After more concentrated focus and observation, I saw that the system had plenty of power to drive the tractor and the implements worked smoothly and as expected. I noticed that, attached to the control mechanism, was a shock absorber! The parts diagram calls it a stabilizer. Bingo! I pulled it off and, indeed, it was no longer working. A new one is coming today and I'm anxious to install and try it out.
After removing the old stabilizer, I continued removing the encrusted crud and saw this:
IMG_0907.JPG

IMG_0906.JPG

As you can see, there is a severe crease in this hose which carries the fluid from the pump to the filter. Something like this should have an impact on the performance of the hydraulics. I think, when replacing this hose, I will have a longer one built and then reroute it to try to avoid the kink.

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GMJohnny
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby GMJohnny » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:43 pm

WXO...

Perhaps you can get a hose with a 90* or 45* fitting on it to help improve the angle down. Talk to
your hose guy. That definitely can't be helping the machine work properly, hydraulic flow is important
to a hydrostatic machine.

GM

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:00 am

Having seen this, I'm getting more enthusiastic about refurbishing ol' Gladys. When I started to remove the stabilizer, I dreaded the thought of trying to get a wrench on the nut on the inside bottom. Clearly, it was going to be difficult if not impossible. Just because I didn't have any good options, I just tried to unscrew it. And it worked! Something was holding the nut in place. Lo and behold, someone had glued the nut onto the shock. What a great idea. So I did the same thing with the new shock. Good ol' JB Weld is now holding the nut. It's glued to the rubber with only minimal holding power on the metal, but it should do well to keep the nut in place until I can tighten it in place
IMG_0921.JPG
.

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:31 pm

I've got the Jackleg blues. After spending hours trying to install the new stabilizer I finally referred to the parts diagram and saw that the bottom of the shock should be outside the frame, NOT INSIDE. All this time, It has been installed cocked so that it is not in line with its actuator. Give me a break! :x
Forget all that about gluing the nut on. I've got to rethink how to get this into the proper location. All the sudden I've lost the fun factor. :x

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Sun Sep 10, 2017 5:39 pm

Several more hours of wrenching and re-engineering and I've got the motion control working pretty well. All the testing and adjusting identified the location of significant hydraulic fluid leak. It's the one I've been looking for. It is leaking from around the the front shifter shaft. Looks like the seal is gone. I wonder if I can just jerk out the seal and replace it with a new one without disassembling anything.

Either way, I'm taking some time off for a holiday with Randi. I'll get back to it next week.

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GMJohnny
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby GMJohnny » Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:31 pm

We have done many seals on hydraulic rams and they can usually just be popped in
place. I'm not certain how that one works or what the seal is actually doing.You may
have to research that one.

GM

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wxo
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby wxo » Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:46 pm

This seal surrounds a shifter shaft. It moves only about 1/2 turn back and forth when shifting from low range to high range on the front transaxle. It looks like it can be popped out. I'll see what I can find out about it, but info is scarce on the web when it comes to Steiners.

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wxo
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Gladys has her mojo back

Postby wxo » Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:42 pm

Two things to report today. It appears that the hydraulic leak has been fixed by the replacement of the shifter shaft seal. It's now dry underneath. Woo hoo!

Another problem that has been plaguing me is the carb. I've taken it apart 3 previous times with no success. I had given up and ordered a new carb from Kubota only to find out that it has been back ordered with an unknown shipment date. Well, Maverick and I took another crack at it. He had a gallon of carb cleaner so I took it over and soaked it for 24 hours. Then we took it apart and cleaned it and found a very tiny air bleed for the idle circuit. I had blown air through this passage in the past, but never had a small enough wire to push through it. Maverick pulled out a set of almost microscopic drill bits and the smallest one fit the orifice. When I pushed it through, I felt some semi-solid resistance like gum. Once all cleaned up, we put it together and I installed it this afternoon. Once the float bowl filled, it fired immediately and ran nicely. A couple of quick adjustments and it was idling like never before. It is starting better, too. It has always required choke to start even when hot. Not now. It starts, runs and idles like it should. Woo Hoo (again). Time to cancel the carb order. Thanks Maverick.

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Maverick
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Re: Steiner/Ransomes Model 420

Postby Maverick » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:28 pm

Excellent!! Success is fun!!
Maverick


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