1972 Maverick Sprint

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Maverick
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2-Speed Fan Circuits and Breakers for Headlights

Post by Maverick »

A 2-speed Taurus electric radiator fan was previously installed with a single speed controller running only the low speed. (I learned of better options after I bought the 1-speed controller.) Thinking was that my aluminum radiator MIGHT have sufficient cooling capacity with just the low speed. If that turned out to not be true, I could imagine how to add a relay to support the second (high) speed.

Well, cooling is marginal with low speed fan when idleing with AC on high and air temp in the 90s. Since I have to plan on air temp in the 100s, the high speed would be a good idea so I've been working on it.

Adding high speed has some challenges:

1. The Taurus fan is not designed to have both high and low speeds powered at the same time. (Think that is OK with some 2-speed fans.)

2. Its also not designed to power on high speed unless the fan is turning at low speed. Switching on high speed when the fan is stopped draws excessive current and will burn out the motor.

3. There's a high momentary current draw with the fan enters high speed. High speed circuit needs fuse and relay for at least 60 amps.

So, I needed minumum 60 amp circuit breaker and 5-pin (SPDT) relay. It would have been best to find an auto reset circuit breaker but I didn't find one with sufficient capacity for the high speed and settled for a melting fuse. The low speed circuit is protected with a resetting circuit breaker so maybe that's good enough.

Neither could I find a 5-pin relay with sufficient capacity. Had to use two relays: one 40 amp 5-pin that just feeds power alternatively to the low speed controller or a 4-pin 60 amp realy for the high speed. Had a professional do the professional circuit design and professional circuit diagram. :mrgreen:

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While all these electrical gadgets were being installed I decided to prepare for a later improvement: headlight relays. Early Fords had a resetting circuit breaker for the headlights integrated in the light switch. These are known to go bad and leave you on a dark, 2-lane country road with no lights. :shock: I KNOW that's true -- it happend to me. The car has a new FOMOCO light switch but a better solution is resetting circuit breakers and relays to avoid all that current thru the switch. That'll happen in the future, so why not at least get the circuit breakers added while the 2-speed fan is being set up?

So, here is the assembly of the 60 amp hi speed fan fuse, two resetting 20 amp circuit breakers for the lights, and a 50 amp resetting circuit breaker for the low speed fan circuit. (Having separate breakers for bright and dim means I should always have one or the other.)

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The steel bar is a buss for the four devices.

And, here it is with the two relays for the 2-speed fan circuits.

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I didn't want all that uglyness visible in my engine compartment so its mounted behind the battery. Only the tops of the relays are visible.

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There's good news and bad news. The operation was a success but the patient died. The circuits work just like the sensors tell them to but the sensors aren't giving good directions. The low speed controller has a probe in the radiator fins to sense temperature. It works fine by itself.

The high speed sensor is mounted in the thremostat housing on the radiator side of the 195* thermostat. Its supposed to switch the high speed on at 210* and off at 195* It switches on at about 210* but doesn't switch off till about 185*, which it never sees behind my 195* thermostat.

So, when the thermostat opens and dumps hot coolant into the radiator, the fan goes on low speed. But, when the heat builds to 210* and the high speed gets switched on, it won't switch off while the engine is running. Meanwhile, the probe in the aluminum radiator is cool and happy, not calling for the low speed.

When the engine is shut off, the high speed sensor in the thermostat housing is still hot so its running the fan on high.

I know this is way more detail than anyone cares about. Just had to write it down to help me think about where to go from here. For now, I just pulled the connector on the high speed sensor which makes it all work just like it did before all the gadgets were added.

I could reinstall my 180* thremostat and then maybe the sensor would turn off the high speed circuit. Hate to do that because the engine runs a LOT better up around 200*. Gotta think about it ...
Maverick
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Fred32v
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Fred32v »

oldvettedad wrote:I could reinstall my 180* thremostat and then maybe the sensor would turn off the high speed circuit. Hate to do that because the engine runs a LOT better up around 200*. Gotta think about it ...
I've always run a cooler thremostat, even 160's, put the 180 in.
If it's not running the way you want, tune for it.
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Maverick
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Maverick »

Fred32v wrote:
oldvettedad wrote:I could reinstall my 180* thremostat and then maybe the sensor would turn off the high speed circuit. Hate to do that because the engine runs a LOT better up around 200*. Gotta think about it ...
I've always run a cooler thremostat, even 160's, put the 180 in.
If it's not running the way you want, tune for it.
Fred, it doesn't idle well and has some hesitation till its really warmed up. I think the carb circuits that would have to be enlarged do not have replaceable jets. Think I'd have to completely disassemble the new carb and permanently drill out some orifices. Since its fine with the stock 195* thermostat, I'm not that confident in what it needs to run well cold, and I'd hate to disassemble and permanently modify the new carb, I'm reluctant to take that on.

Another possible cause of the cold bloodedness is the exhaust passages in the intake maniforld might be blocked off. Didn't check the used Edelbrock Performer before it was installed. You probably know that some guys block those off to get a cooler charge into the engine. Bro Willy suspected that. I checked the temp of that area of the intake and it was cooler than the intake runners. :? Maybe if there was some heat on the intake manifold it would run well with a 180* thermostat. But, I also hate the thought of taking the intake off my newly assembled engine to check it out.

Right now I'm thinking the setup would work better if the low temp/low speed sensor were in the thermostat housing and the high temp/high speed sensor were in the radiator. Think that could be done with a different sensor and some re-rigging of the circuits.

Thanks for comments. Helps me think about it.

Jim
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Fred32v
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Fred32v »

I blocked the exhaust heat passages on my Olds 455, ran the 160 all winter
and compensated by enriching the choke and turning up the cold speed idle.
Just my 2 cents. Grins!
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Maverick
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Maverick »

Reinstalled the 180* thermostat and turned the adjustable low speed controller, with probe in the radiator, all the way cold. Expect the low speed will run any time the thermostat is open. Maybe the rough idle and hesitation won't be so bad in this weather.

With outside temp in the 80s and the engine idleing, it doesn't get hot enough to trip the 210* sensor in the thermostat housing. We'll see how it acts when outside temp is higher.

I have some LED indicator lights that will be installed to tell me when the AC compressor and low and hi speeds are operating. Plan to add them to the gauge panel that's back ordered from Summit. Just might have to install them temporarily to observe what's happening when its on the road now.

Think the intake manifold is gonna have to come off before Fall. :(
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Fred32v »

Ain't engineering fun. :)
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Maverick »

Yeah, I think about what Tom Edison said. :mrgreen: Something like "If you try something and it doesn't work, its not failure. You know one more thing that won't work." Think he tried about 1800 filaments for the electric light before he hit on the carbon filament.

Car runs OK w/180* thermostat in this weather. :D

LEDs are mounted and grounded. Just gotta run three wires and I'll know what's happening with the fan while driving.

Appreciate the comments.
Maverick
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Fred32v
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Fred32v »

Maverick wrote:
MostMint wrote:my guess is 1/4 mile time in the 14.70's
We'll probably go to Benson/Dunn, 1/8th mile. Care to translate? MPH?
I just went to the DunBensonDragstrip.com site and got a little suprise. Are they still running.
We can hardly wait for the Mavrick vs WXO match up at the end of the month. :?:

When your done, we would like a side by side like this one.
Image
Notice the size of the trophies, and BP got the money too.
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wxo
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by wxo »

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Fred32v
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Fred32v »

Much better. :oops:
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oldvettedad
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by oldvettedad »

Hey Jim,
Good luck tonight. Remember i had the most faith in you - 9.25 - :shock:
I won't know how you did till next week. Leaving for Maple Grove (Geezers Reunion at the Grove) for a 2 day Nostalgia race. goos luck and have fun. Oh and don't forget the tow rope so you can tow Walt's SS home :mrgreen:
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by Maverick »

It was a beautiful evening at the Dunn-Benson 1/8 Mile, at least weather wise. WXO kicked my butt all night long. Tried 4 runs but no good ones. Transmission was not shifting right.

This afternoon, on a trial run on some country roads, everything looked good. Got my second tack memory device from Summit (first one didn't work) installed and working so I could record the shift points. Starting in Drive, 1-2 upshift was perfect at 5400 RPM. 2-3 upshift was 5100 and that's fine since I'm done racing before it sees 3rd gear. Thinking I could just run in Drive.

On the track, however the transmission did not behave well at all. On the first run the engine hit 6000 rpm in 1st hear and started to float the valves. On another I had to let off because again it wasn't doing the 1-2 upshift when it should. On another it was slipping in 1st gear and I had to let off to let it shift. That was the 4th run and I quit rather than destroy the transmission. 4th run was the best ET.

4th Run:

Reaction time .7372
60 ft 2.2581
330 ft 6.338
1/8th ET 9.9737
1/8 MPH 64.28

Fred32V, you win the (no prize) contest with an amazing guess of 9.95. Could have done better if transmission were working right. Plan to drain off a little excess ATF and install a transmission cooler. Not sure what to make of the perfect shift points on the road and over-reving and slipping at the track.

Oh yeah, and my WXO's Trailblazer SS kicked my butt all night long. Not many racers there early so we got to run, drive back and be 1st in line to run again. Did all 4 runs side by side. :mrgreen: We had a really good time.

Our friend Jim Hall severed as pit crew, camera man, and chief video processor. Got this great video of the last run.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2G9eRzxeAzs

We ended up for beer and video processing in my family room. Hope to do it again real soon.
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by MostMint »

Next time let the car sit between passes. Let it sit for 45-60 minutes. The hood has to be open to let heat out faster. You might benefit from getting there before the gates open and letting it sit and cool off. Also no lengthy idling in line to get in. After you get the heat out from the drive you might be able to hot lap it there, but maybe not. The external cooler might help but no guarantees.
[quote="Basement Paul"]Is that a mint rocketship on the hood?? :shock:
-BP[/quote]
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wxo
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by wxo »

Andy, don't forget who you are talking to here. We are just two old guys who haven't been to the track for ages and with untested cars come the strip to race and have some fun. We had to walk up and down the track to see where the staging lights were. We then walked to the end to make sure we knew where the end of the 1/8 miles was. :oops: Neither one of us has faced a Christmas tree for years (in Jim's case decades). We were just glad to get some runs in to brush off the rust. Maybe next time we'll open the hood. :D
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Re: 1972 Maverick Sprint

Post by MostMint »

Pardon my direct tone, or if I'm repeating stuff you already know. Just tryin to help the old guys is all.
[quote="Basement Paul"]Is that a mint rocketship on the hood?? :shock:
-BP[/quote]
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