1981 El Camino

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Maverick
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1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

Looks like I'll be starting a new project. A friend of a friend looked it over, test drove it, and verified the description today. Its for sale in Saratoga Springs, NY. Seller and I agreed on a deal.
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There are still a few things that could queer the deal but I think it's going to work out. Seller is willing to deliver it to the Binghamton, NY area and a friend, Barry, will store it there till a road trip can be arranged to get it. WXO and another friend, Jim, offered to help get it although WXO has a complication that we'll have to work out. When everyone's schedule and weather allow, we'll drive up to Binghamton, stay overnight, and drive it home.

It started life as a 6 cyl but now has a 350. Here's the description the seller posted on the El Camino forum.

Not sure what I'll do with it. Probably just enjoy it as is for a while.
Sadly I must sell my '81 El Camino, health and other reasons force the sale. It's located Upstate NY, between Albany and Saratoga and has been babied all its life although I've only enjoyed it since 2009. It's a show winner including one at the Chevelle/El Camino show in MA a few years back. CARFAX is clean, it was sold new in Riverside CA and made its way East at some point since then. Originally a blue V6 it's now painted Mitsubishi Glacier White Pearl that looks white or silver depending on the sun and its powered by a rebuilt (by the prior owner) 350 engine with a Edelbrock manifold and 4bbl with Hedman headers and true dual exhausts through chambered mufflers, many F-41 suspension parts as well. Factory a/c is ice cold, new heater core makes for a toasty warm fall weather ride. Water pump is a year old, grille is new aftermarket, I saved the original one. New aftermarket rear bumper, Craftec bed cover, aftermarket XM radio/CD player with appropriate speakers, Monte Carlo steering wheel, no power windows, new carpeted pass through cover too. It rides on 15" Corvette rally wheels with excellent tires as shown in the photos. Frame is solid, always garaged, car cover is included. Photos will show the good and the bad, the bad being some surface rust areas but no rust through problems. The good is everything else you can see.
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GMJohnny
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by GMJohnny »

Nice!!!! Having spent many years wrenching on mid-80's GM vehicles,
I'm a fan!!

GM
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Maverick
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

The deal is solidifying. The seller listed it as "sold" on the El Camino forum. I put a check in the mail yesterday to my "broker" in Apalachin, NY. Broker, Barry, hooked me up with his bro-in-law, Bill, to check out the Elco. Seller, Gary, has agreed to deliver it to Barry. Barry will check it out on arrival and store it temporarily till we can get up to get it. Barry will deliver the check to Gary, get the signed title and bill-of-sale, and mail them to me. I'll apply for an NC title and get a plate to take up and put on for the trip home.

It ain't easy to buy a vehicle in another state while verifying the description, assessing the road-worthiness, doing a safe money transfer, and planning a road trip around the weather and three guys' schedules. :? Thanks to Barry the broker, Bill the inspector, Gary the cooperative seller, the (hopefully) cooperative weather, and (hopefully) two co-pilots WXO and Jim, I think its going to work. :D

Tentative plan is to go up sometime between 1/9 and 1/15 when we have two days of clear roads.
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Basement Paul
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Basement Paul »

Good luck. It looks like a real nice car.

-BP
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Maverick
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

No glitches so far. Barry in Apalachin, NY has the check and is ready to receive the El Camino. Still hoping to get it between 1/9 and 1/15.

I find myself perusing Craigslist for hotrodded small blocks and big blocks. LOTS of salvage, flood and otherwise, chevy trucks here. https://www.salvageautosauction.com/
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

Still no plan to retrieve the El Camino from NY. We have a major snow storm moving in on us today and tomorrow followed by a few days of cold weather. And, I'm down with a bad cold so I need to get past the contagious stage before I sit in the car for hours with WXO and Jim. Maybe by the end of next week?

In the meantime, I'm trying to learn a bit about Bow Tie engines. WXO points out that BBC engines were not available in Gen 3 (1978-1987) El Caminos so I'm focusing on SBCs. Found two good references:

. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LS_based_ ... ock_engine

. https://www.amazon.com/Chevrolet-Small- ... lock+bible

You Bow Tie fans would enjoy them I think. They're giving me some good reading while I'm convalescing.

Something I haven't found is engine mounts and bellhousing bolt patterns for the LS engines. Don't know if they are compatible with the earlier small blocks or not. IF (big if) I change engines it would be nice to be able to reuse the TH350 and headers. If they're not compatible, that factor would bias me toward the earlier SBC.
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

Got the El Camino insured and registered. We (four of us) plan to leave tomorrow at 6 AM for Apalachin, NY to retrieve the El Camino. Weather looks good on this end and just OK on the NY end. Have our winter duds packed. We're planning a "team" (inspector, broker/storer, and transporters) dinner and refreshments at Bud's Tavern tomorrow evening. Should be a fun trip!! Wish us safe traveling.
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Fred32v
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Fred32v »

Sure sounds like a great memory maker, enjoy!

(Can't wait for the stories.)
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

Got 'er home!! 10 hours, 45 minutes on Thurs from WXO's house to Barry, the broker/storer's house in Apalachin, NY. LOTS of debate about the best route. One wants I-95, two hate I-95. One prefers I-64. One prefers I-66. WXO was appointed Commander in Chief of Routes. Didn't help much because everyone still has "input". :mrgreen:

Beautiful sun rise and HARD rain from Scranton, PA to Barry's house in Apalachin, NY. Since the rain was supposed to stop in an hour or so, we went to dinner at Bud's Place in Apalachin, NY. In attendance were the three transporters, the inspector, the broker/storer, JImM the Master of Ceremonies for all events, and me. Very lively and fun time. :lol: By the time dinner was over, the rain had stopped. We drove 30 minutes to the garage where the El Camino was stored only to find out the keys were NOT hidden in the car. :( So we waited an hour while Barry returned home to get the keys. Car started right up but the electric choke on the Edelbrock carb did not open when the engine started. Choke pull off wasn't working. Had to hold the choke open till the electric choke opened up then, off to the Comfort Inn. But, no reservation for us. :shock: Showed the clerk my papers and she calmly pointed out the reservation was for the Quality Inn next door. Everyone was pointing out I'd said "Comfort inn". in the "Plan". Tried to claim I said "Comfortable Inn" but couldn't make it stick. :oops:

Lots of good natured criticism of my "plan" because it didn't include specifics on just how the car was to get from storage to us. What genius could predict our arrival time, the marginal weather events, and some other variables? But, that argument got me no relief. :roll:

Anyway, over to the Quality Inn and pull out the license plate to install it ... no screws. Barry goes BACK to his house to retrieve some license plates screws, Ahh!! Plate installed and off to bed.

Up at 5 AM today and lucked out. The hotel complimentary breakfast that wasn't scheduled till 6:30 was available to us before 6. I intended to adjust the choke to prevent warm up issues but it had metric Allen screws and my little tool kit doesn't contain metric Allen wrench.

OK!! We're on our way. A wrong turn got us a pre-dawn tour of downtown Binghamton. Not the highlight of the trip. :cry:

On the way home, the Commander of Routes got his way and we COMPLETELY avoided I-95 by heading down US-15. Turns out it was a very pleasant route. More divided highway and limited access highway than I expected. Very relaxing compared to the Interstates. BEAUTIFUL sunset over the lake in VA.

The El Camino has some really good points and some disappointments. There are more rust issues than advertised, e.g., bubbling on the hood lip and a little on the roof. The TH350 is great! Firm but not harsh shifts. Upshifts and downshifts are very well timed. The engine used/leaked 2 quarts of oil on the 600 mile trip home. That will take some investigation. There was a one-inch puddle of oil in 30 minutes under the center of the engine. Pan gasket? I'll do a compression test and leak-down test to get some idea of what's up with the engine. It runs smooth and quiet kinda hard starting. Brakes work very well. Steerng has a little play but it tracks straight and stable. Corners well. Tires have great tread but were on the El Camino when the seller bought the car in 2009. (Glad they held together for the trip home.) I'll look for a date code. Gas gauge is unpredictable. Voltmeter shows 12V or less most of the time. Clock runs intermittently. Speedometer is 10-15% slow, maybe from a smaller drive gear in the replaced TH350? Driver's door needs work. It takes a SLAM to get it shut. Window rattles dangerously. Exhaust system is cobbled up. Headers leading to about 1 1/2" pipe under the trans cross member. :cry: Sounds leaky and harsh from the outside but good on the inside. Basically, I'd say it's what should be expected from a 35 year-old vehicle with 100K+ miles and not much use (or tinkering?) in the last few years. I would have offered him less If I'd seen it in person.

I didn't take any pictures. If I come across any I'll add them to the thread.

I'm sure a good time was had by all. I really appreciate all the help in getting the deal done and the El Camino transported home. I have lots to keep me busy for a long time. But, tonight I'm REALLY tired.
Last edited by Maverick on Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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wxo
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by wxo »

Dan took this picture of the El Camino in it's storage place while we were waiting for the key to arrive.
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Maverick
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

Not much energy today but I did get out to have a look at the Elky. Got the block casting number (8970010) but couldn't see all of the codes on the right front of the block. First four characters are V042 but couldn't see the rest of the code. Think the block casting number means its either a 327 or a 350. Was advertised as a 350 and I expect it is.

I'll do the compression and lead down tests but expect the engine is worn out. So, I've begun to think about "refresh" options. Called Prestige Motorsports, the guys that built the 347 for the Maverick, and talked about this crate engine but with aftermarket TB EFI. https://prestigemoto.com/383-chevy-stro ... e-420.html

If the current engine is a roller cam block, I'd consider rebuilding it with stroker and top end kits.

Somehow I got the idea that the Elky weighed 4000 lbs but looking around on the Internet it appears its probably 3500-3600. A 383 stroker should move it pretty good.

Of course, all this is just brain storming till I figure out the state of the current engine.

The Elky has the same 7.5 rear end as BP's S10 pickup had. I sent a query to BP's guys, JD Race.

I'm buying an '81 El Camino with, I assume, the 7.5" rear end. It will be getting 450 HP so the rear will have to be replaced. It will be used primarily on the street with a few trips to the strip. TH350 with drag radials for the strip. I expect an 8.5" rear would be adequate but would like your opinion on that. Can you give me a ball park price for the complete rear axle with 3.2-3.3 posi incl shipping to 27613, Raleigh NC?

Got this response.

Jim, We do not have any core Original GM 8.5 rear in stock and we rarely ever do.

We do make our own 10 bolt 8.5 with gm part Housings to create a stout 10 bolt 8.5…Again Nothing build as of yet.

Only optional rear we have for with in the week is a NEW 12 bolt Moser engineering Housing rear that will be a direct bolt into your chassis it is 2350.00 NO BRAKES eaton posi 3.08 3.31 3.42 3.73 3.90 4.10 4.56 ratio choice Alloy axles 30 spline all new bearings and seals

I am trying to get some 8.5 and 8.8 housings done before the end of the month but snow and regular orders are swamping us in. J Jim

Shipping is 162.89 for a terminal pick-up at Fed ex FREIGHT in

5210 Trademark Drive

Raleigh NC 27610


Anyone think the 8.5 10-bolt would be inadequate for 400 HP? I'm guessing the 12-bolt would be overkill.
Last edited by Maverick on Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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GMJohnny
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by GMJohnny »

Maverick,

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, I / We spent many hours working on this style of car when
we were young. We actually used the 7.5" rear ends and they were pretty tough. Our cars weren't
drag cars, but we POUNDED those poor rear ends, with minimal failure. I ran a 403 Oldsmobile in
front of one with a 3.42 gear in it, and MostMint ran a 350 in front of one that had 4.11's in it.
Motor failure was more of an issue than the rear end failing in those days. None of our cars were
putting out 400 hp, but none of the drivers worried about repairing the car. speed, cool burnouts,
and hard launches at the track were always most important. Personally, I'd run the rear end until
the car spit it out the back unless you hate the gears or are upgrading to a posi. I can tell you that,
if you are able to stumble across a 442 or a Grand National of mid 80's vintage, they come stock
with an 8.5" 3.73 posi which is an ideal rear end for your car. The trans is an overdrive 200r4 that
is awesome as well. Just a tidbit of info from my encyclopedia of experience.

Good Luck!

GM
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Maverick
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Maverick »

Hey GM,

You're right, of course. I edited out the "fragile" descriptor of the 7.5 in the previous post. That was overstating the issue.

I think the 7.5 would be OK with street tires and open rear end regardless of HP. Haven't checked the rear end ratio but it definitely needs some steeper gears. Also, if I got the 383, it would have to be a posi to get the HP to the pavement. Expect its open now. Given those changes, it makes sense to go to the 8.5.

We have some warm weather coming this week so maybe I can spend some time in the garage and get some of these unknowns nailed down.

WXO and I had the same thought about the hard starting. It MIGHT be choke related. I tried to ease it off some before we left NY but didn't have any TORX wrenches with me. Edelbrock choke adjustment uses TORX headed screws. :? Backed it off some so now I'll see what effect that has.

Also overstated the problem with the "1 1/4 inch" section of exhaust pipe. It's really a 1 1/2" section. :roll: Headers are also 1.5" tubes so they would have to be replaced if I do the 383. This project is either going to be BIG or quite limited.
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Basement Paul
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by Basement Paul »

The 8.5" will be plenty. No need at all for the 12 bolt. JD Race Jim runs an 8.5" in his own 10sec Monza, identical to what he describes in his email, which is what's now in my S-10. Unless you put a trans brake and slicks on it, you'll never hurt it.

Looks like a lot of questions marks, but not too far beyond what you expected. It will be fun seeing it progress.

-BP
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Re: 1981 El Camino

Post by TireSmoker »

That block casting number is more likely 3970010, not 8970010. Very common, but not a roller cam block.

-Dave
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